Loss of megaupload

[Gsus]

I think the distinction is that it isn't the piracy itself that is the theft.. it's the delivery system.

The argument has always been that 14 year olds just won't go out and buy the 100 albums they downloaded from torrent sites - so the industry saying that they lost 10 billion in sales is always wrong. That's not theft, and anyone who says it is needs to pick up a dictionary.

What has started to happen instead though is piracy sites running alongside industry equivalents (at least to some degree) and the piracy sites stealing the business. There are now quite a few music subscription sites, and for the most part they're generally useful for people. You could compare an ad supported/donation based torrent site alongside Spotify if people use them for the same thing.

It is theft because the piracy sites remove business from legitimate sites they steal something. The actual piracy itself is not theft, because nothing is removed or taken.

[les]

I remember the early days of video tape.
A film would cost 5 to 10 times the weekly wage of people.
So several people wold rent a film copy it and pass it around .
inevitably the quality of copied copies went down hill fast.
When Disney released its back catalogue they priced the films at £9.99.
which made suffering bad copies not worth the effort.

The modern day copies are usually good but some files are low definition.
the answer is to make the product freely available at the price people are willing to pay.

I will stick my neck out and say most want "legal" product otherwise no shop would ever sell the original.
I do know of lots of people who do not know how to get "Pirate Copies", they are the ones that can and do buy legal.
Most kids can't afford originals, but I would wager that when they are in work the would rather buy than pirate.
I also remember when the cassette copier was built into the radio this would see the demise of the music industry.
The reason many presenters are paid so much is that the media company behind them does not have to pay to show or play media that needs paying for.
As well as gaining big audiences to increase advertising fees.
Used to be called needle time in the days of radio.


The point I am making as technology evolves the industry must adapt
Those that don't can not undo evolution, no matter how hard they scream.

It is stupid how much money is spent "wasted" in preventing us,
from obtaining the many different things we want.

[janmb]

I think the distinction is that it isn't the piracy itself that is the theft.. it's the delivery system

The communication system used for piracy is even farther from the definition of theft - contrary to what the industry likes to claim, it isn't even really qualifying as an accessory.

[janmb]

I will stick my neck out and say most want "legal" product otherwise no shop would ever sell the original.

Absolutely! Spotify and similar services are great examples of just that - people prefer buying original/official/legal content over using cumbersome, potentially infested illegal copies, poor quality copies, where you risk both viruses and legal prosecution.

It has long been a term from the industry that "you cannot compete with free". That is pure and utter bullshit and I don't believe they actually believe it themselves even for a second. It's pure propaganda, spread for two specific purposes: Manipulating public attitude toward the illegality of copyright infringement, and more importantly, lobbying for politicians and the legal system to make them rule in their favor both when creating new laws and in terms of enforcing them.

Provide a reasonably priced, high quality product on a communication format the users want and people buy it - easily. It's that easy. The only thing it really necessitates is that the industry realizes that CD factories MUST GO TO HELL and that they can no longer play vampire with their slave artists. It's on high time the artists actually got the far bigger piece of the cake they deserve, and the industry (read; record labels) should grab far less. Current advertisement and distribution costs are SO MUCH less than they used to be, and whether they like it or not, the prices they claim need to reflect that. Cut expenses! Shutting down CD factories and distribution costs is a good start. Shutting down the MASSIVE expenses used on legal matters is another example of how you can easily live with far far less income than they like to claim.

In fact, piracy is the first time ever this industry has had to cope with any sort of true competition - cut the whining and deal with it - like any other business has been doing for decades. Offer a product of a quality and price the customers PREFER and voila! You sell!

[les]

My dad always said something is only worth what you can get for it.

If you can make a product,
    That people want and then
        Charge a price people are prepared to pay for it,

                                You will make money.

Take smuggling if the price difference is enough and the quality acceptable.........

[janmb]

Precisely.

It's the same thing happening every day in my own country... We have extremely high prices/taxes on stuff like alcohol and tobacco, both because of the general policies the government has toward limiting the use of these things as much as possible... And every time they tune those taxes higher (happen every so often), the amount of "leakage" in the form of import (legal and otherwise) naturally increases. And in turn the politicians who are directly to blame for this effect happening at all, whine their asses off about how immoral people are for doing this.... I for one would like for my elected politicians to have enough IQ and/or education to understand as basic economy as we're talking about here. Make something too expensive and the customers will seek other outlets... It's that simple, regardless of WHY you want the price to be high. You always have to accept and acknowledge the fact that there is a limit to what the people are prepared to pay for your services.

[Gsus]

I think the distinction is that it isn't the piracy itself that is the theft.. it's the delivery system

The communication system used for piracy is even farther from the definition of theft - contrary to what the industry likes to claim, it isn't even really qualifying as an accessory.

By the delivery system I mean ratio based trackers where many people have to make donations to maintain ratio. Effectively you're buying your content that way rather than a fiver on Netflix. There's trackers out there specifically designed to make as much money as possible, and they're in direct competition with Netflix/LoveFilm etc.

A not for profit private tracker, or a free for all public tracker is a different thing.

[Evals]

Down goes cheggit.net. Trying to avoid the cliche'd Queen reference, but alas, it keeps playing in my head.

[janmb]

By the delivery system I mean ratio based trackers where many people have to make donations to maintain ratio. Effectively you're buying your content that way rather than a fiver on Netflix. There's trackers out there specifically designed to make as much money as possible, and they're in direct competition with Netflix/LoveFilm etc.

A not for profit private tracker, or a free for all public tracker is a different thing.

Making money is not theft either, unless you directly take those money AWAY FROM someone else. Making them through revenue, which is what we are effectively discussing here, is something quite else and usually nothing to fret over.

Also keep in mind, the trackers and sharing sites who make profit do so due to their site having traffic, not due to other breaking the law. The share of the traffic which is illegal does not, per megabyte transferred, produce any more or any less profit than legal traffic does. Which in turn means that even if you set up a site to make profit, based on traffic, you are NOT implicitly inviting illegal files haring. You are inviting traffic, legal or not.